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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Verschlüsselung mit TLS (Read 52217 times)
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #30 - 23. Mar 2010 at 08:57
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deti wrote on 22. Mar 2010 at 23:34:
ZRTP hört sich interessant an und für den Anwender einfach und sicher! Hab mir mal die Seiten von Zfone gründlich durchgelesen. Werd bei Gelegenheit deren Produkt mal mit PhonerLite testen.

Zfone nützt dir gar nichts, wenn du TLS verwendest. Zfone scannt den Netzwerktraffic und patched die Pakete. Als Demo ist das in Ordnung, aber für den Produktiveinsatz meiner Meinung nach nicht zu gebrauchen.
Eine Applikation müsste ZRTP direkt integrieren, dann macht das Sinn. Es gibt ja existierende Softphones mit ZRTP-Unterstützung.
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #31 - 03. May 2010 at 00:20
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I like PhonerLite portable version very much. However I find there are a couple of issues : 

If TLS doesn't work, it automatically tries TCP then UDP. 
This is dangerous !!! Because if I want ONLY TLS and don't want my SRTP keys going over unencrypted channels, PhonerLite SHOULD NOT automatically select TCP by SIP. 
So the configuration should be not "preferred connection type", but just "connection type" and PhonerLite should ONLY do what user requests.

By the way, ZRTP license doesn't allow you to include it ?

ZRTP is useful even there is TLS (TLS + SRTP) because ZRTP can do end to end encryption. SRTP keys are provided by the SIP server and the SIP server can decode the RTP stream if it wanted. With ZRTP it cannot. So ZRTP is very useful to add.

Translation in German : 
Ich mag PhonerLite portable Version sehr viel. Doch ich finde, es gibt ein paar Fragen:

Wenn TLS nicht funktioniert, wird es automatisch versucht dann TCP UDP.
Das ist gefährlich! Weil, wenn ich will nur TLS und wollen nicht meine SRTP Tasten gehen über unverschlüsselte Kanäle, PhonerLite sollten nicht automatisch durch die Option TCP SIP.
Also die Konfiguration sollte nicht "bevorzugte Verbindungsart", sondern nur "Connection Type" und PhonerLite sollte nur tun, was Benutzer fordert.

By the way, hat ZRTP Lizenz nicht zulassen, dass du es auch?

ZRTP ist nützlich, auch dort ist TLS (TLS + SRTP), weil ZRTP Ende tun können, um die Verschlüsselung zu beenden. SRTP Tasten sind durch den SIP-Server und dem SIP-Server können sich auf die RTP-Streams dekodieren, wenn er wollte. Mit ZRTP kann es nicht. So ZRTP ist sehr nützlich, um hinzuzufügen.
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #32 - 03. May 2010 at 10:45
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PhonerLite doesn't use the connection type explicitly. Therefore it is named "preferred". If your counterpart doesn't support TLS, just drop the call.
I can't use ZRTP because of the license. PhonerLite is not GPL based!
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #33 - 03. May 2010 at 21:37
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Thanks for the prompt response.

I know that's why it is called preferred as I already mentioned. What I am suggesting is that you change it to desired or something like that, or add something that says "require tls" so that when the user of phonerlite puts tls, he can be sure that phonerlite will ONLY use TLS, if not it won't connect.

I have been running voip servers, and suggesting and configuring clients (hard and softphones) for 4 years, and believe me this would be a good addition or removal of an issue with phonerlite.

End user should not be subjected to having to check if the connection is TLS etc. Its not just SRTP keys, but even the password is lost.

Without this phonerlite is would give false impression of security. Between UDP and TCP it is ok, but when TLS is selected it should ONLY do TLS. Otherwise I suggest adding an option as "force" to follow the protocol given by user.

  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #34 - 03. May 2010 at 21:46
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I find that the TLS handshake does not finish with freeswitch server (The same server works with eyebeam, pangolin and snom phones).

I have attached the sip trace below as seen on the server side. It appears phonerlite is sending tls using different port than it is listening. The local port option in the configuration was unchanged and set to 5060.

The server is doing the corrent thing as per the SIP RFC. 

I have attached the sip trace as seen on the server side. I have also attached the PhonerLite.log (next post since only 1 attachment allowed)

Can you please look into this issue and fix it ?
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #35 - 03. May 2010 at 21:47
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Attachment of phonerlite.log for above post.
  

PhonerLite_log.txt ( 16 KB | Downloads )
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #36 - 03. May 2010 at 23:22
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The TLS registration is very flaky. Phonerlite is not able to decode received TLS data sometimes it appears. I saw the log on phonerlite side and on the server side. I put wireshark on the phonerlite side. It does receive SIP responses on the phonerlite side PC, but phonerlite simply says waiting for transactions. Its as if phonerlite is unable to see the traffic which I think is because it is not able to decode the TLS ? (because wireshark shows the traffic is received on the interface).
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #37 - 04. May 2010 at 08:30
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"waiting for transaction" is only to be seen, if PhonerLite wants to shutdown or switch the profile. PhonerLite has to wait for an answer before shutting down. You will see this message only after unregistration (expires is 0).
Is there a way to test that for my own? Do you have a public IP and an account, so I can test from here? I can't see any problems with other TLS based servers.
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #38 - 05. May 2010 at 23:47
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I don't have public IP unfortunately. 
I am trying this with freeswitch running on linux. I have seen 2 others complain about the same problem. So it is not just mine. I also upgraded the freeswitch to latest version and tested with 3 other phones.

Do you have freeswitch ? (it takes about 5 minutes human time and about 30 mins machine time to install on a linux vm or spare machine if you have it). Would it possible for you to try it in your lab ? It would be an excellent interop test for phonerlite in general because freeswitch is the most advanced and fastest voip server/switch/pbx in the world.   

If you can't I'll try to get public ip or make another arrangement to help debug this problem, although above would be easiest.
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #39 - 06. May 2010 at 11:04
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I have installed Freeswitch from the repository (http://wiki.freeswitch.org/wiki/Quick_Start) in my Ubuntu on VirtualBox. After starting Freeswitch my virtual Ubuntu was nearly dead. I couldn't use the mouse anymore - there was too heavy load. After removing Freeswitch everything was OK again.
I would prefer to test against an existing installation Smiley
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #40 - 06. May 2010 at 21:44
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Oh ok Smiley that's strange because it works fine here. Anyway we can test against my installation.

I don't have public IP, I can perhaps try putting my debian VM on the DMZ. Other option is you logging into my windows PC.

Can you use remote desktop to log into my windows VM which will run phonerlite and will connect to my debian VM that runs freeswitch ? You can see everything yourself on the windows and phonerlite side, but not the sip trace on the debian VM which I will provide. Would this work ? 

If not remote desktop, vnc (since linux has that) ? Or if you have some other tool in mind, I can install it. 

  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #41 - 07. May 2010 at 13:07
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I have to debug that for my own - remote access doesn't help me for that.
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #42 - 08. May 2010 at 07:43
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Ok, even if you have full access to the phonerlite exe ? In that case I can upload a debian vmware with freeswitch on it that you can download. 
Alternatively due to the huge size and effort to create a fresh install on my side, if you have any vm even ubuntu is fine, I can try and see why the installation fails / how to get it working. 

Did you get a chance to see the sip trace and the logs I sent you ? It seems to show that phonerlite is unable to receive it. Possibly some issue with the ports that it is listening and what a rfc sip server would respond are different. I can collect more logs as you think would be necessary to debug this. Let me know.
  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #43 - 08. May 2010 at 22:08
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I mean if I can ssh into your ubuntu and install freeswitch (don't need X, only ssh console). If you can use a spare vm or simply make a copy of it for this purpose. 

I the vm debian with freeswitch all configured is in vmware (which can be imported into vbox) but its about 2 G in size which I can still upload. 

Please let me know what works best. 

The remote desktop or vnc idea gives you full access to my windows PC along with the phonerlite, by the way. So I feel it should work for debug, but it not for some reason we have above alternatives. 

  
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Re: Verschlüsselung mit TLS
Reply #44 - 12. May 2010 at 06:16
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do you have any suggestions on how to debug ? I will try to get access to a public ip fs meanwhile
  
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